Discussion about this post

User's avatar
Brian Villanueva's avatar

Your lead question reminded me of Pascal. He also believed that reason couldn't get you to faith. In fact, he went further, arguing that the philosophers' god could never be the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

I've always found the Shroud to be one of the Church's most valid relics, mostly because it's one of the few relics the disciples would have access to and would also have been very likely to save.

Expand full comment
Brandon Hendrickson's avatar

As a former-Protestant-turned-atheist-turned-agnostic, I've never actually been among many pro-Shroud-sters, and I haven't even heard even my deeply miracle-seeing Catholic friends bring it up when I've asked for evidence (Fatima is what they point to), so you can guess my biases here!

But I'll say that the facts you listed, if true, would very much move me to be pro-Shroud. I'll read the book. For the moment, I'll list what I've heard that puts me on Team Doubt for this one:

1. It looks like a medieval drawing of Jesus.

2. When it first surfaced in the 1300s, it was denounced as a forgery; the local bishop allowed it to be shown publicly as something of an art piece, so long as there was no confusion as to its authenticity.

3. I'm told that the arms can't actually work — their position is impossible.

4. If I learned the resurrection happened, I wouldn't expect this to exist. If Jesus was resurrected, why would that shoot light, or whatever, out of his body? This feels natural with a folk-physics "life = energy" assumption, but I'm not sure it makes sense with what we now understand to be true of life.

Finally, there's one of the points cited that I've heard the opposite of: the weave of the fabric. I've heard it's a much better match for both the time and the local area. I think I heard that from either one of these Dan McClellan videos:

https://youtu.be/z416X_cmOHM

https://youtu.be/1BMiNvnPEL4

Obviously, I'm happy to change my beliefs on any of this! If the Shroud were real, it would be so WEIRD...

Expand full comment
24 more comments...

No posts

Ready for more?